Wednesday, May 19, 2010

Senator Mike Delph and Immigration Reform

There is nobody I respect more in the Indiana Senate than Senator Mike Delph. Sen. Delph and I agree on probably 95% of the issues. More importantly, the man brings a sense of integrity and a commitment to public service for unselfish reasons, which is more than I can say about many Indianapolis-area politicians. Having said that, one area where we have some disagreement is in the area of immigration.

I say "some" because I agree with Senator Delph on immigration a lot more than he probably realizes. I think we do need immigration laws enforced. I do think we have a right to know who is in the country. I do think we need to stop handing out benefits to illegal immigrants.

The disconnect is an unwillingness for those on Delph's side, the anti-side, to accept that part of the reason we have a problem with illegal immigration is that the immigration process is horribly broken. The anti-folks refuse to argue for any reform of the system whatsoever, only saying that the current laws need to be enforced. As a lawyer whose law firm has done immigration work, I know the system is needlessly complex, expensive and there is a backlog of applications years long. People get frustrated with the very expensive, drawn out process involved in becoming a U.S. Citizen, and the arbitrary decisions they often have to deal with during the process. People give up trying to come into the country the right way , the legal way, and end up doing it the wrong way, by coming to this country illegally.

What we ought to do is to fix the immigration process AND aggressively enforce the law. But for many on the anti-side, talk of any immigration reform is blasphemy, maybe even "amnesty," if it involves anything more than enforcing the existing broken law.

Although people on the anti-side claim they are just against ILLEGAL immigration, I think a sizable percent, if not a majority, simply do not like immigration at all, legal or illegal. That's why they don't want a change in the current broken immigration system. I disagree with that position. I think immigration is extremely beneficial to this country and I, like Senator Delph, want those immigrants to be here legally. But that involves fixing the current immigration system.

This is an issue that screams out for a reasonable compromise.


Guest said...

I suspect that the illegals coming here from Mexico have zero experience with trying to enter legally. Quit making excuses for them-others have made it legally. All the states need this law. By the way all the wimpy men in this country letting the woman governor out alone in this. Political correctness run amok.

Paul K. Ogden said...

Guest makes exactly the point I'm making. He doesn't like immigration. Period. He doesn't care that the immigration system (any immigration lawyer will tell you) is broken and isn't working properly.

Downtown Indy said...

A dandy story on WTHR today.
Hidden camera captured a person supplying license plates to whomever comes in, plunks down $90 bucks, a Power of Attorney and a Federal Employment Id Number - or 'use the ID of somebody else,' he suggests to the hidden-camera person.

Beautiful. The govt still can't close the door on false or at least misleading information being used to get licenses.

Why can someone even go to an apartment and apply for, let alone GET, a license plate?

Indy Student said...

"By the way all the wimpy men in this country letting the woman governor out alone in this."

What does that even mean?

I have serious questions, as do several others such as Judge Napolitono, of this law's constitutionality (even the revised law). And I'm hesitant to give local LEO that aren't trained in such enforcement the duties that currently belong to Homeland Security and ICE

Guest said...

Guest does not make your point- you are turning the words of this guest -me-who's grandparents came here legally. The immigration system is broken because the laws of immigration are not enforced, not updated and improved, are totally ignored resulting in illegals exploiting the system along with those that hire them for cheap labor. Once everyone starts enforcing "illegal" we all will be better off. If we the legal taxpayers have to show ID for everything, everyone should have to -no exeptions. By the way, crimes are commited by illegals and they do not ask them their status?? Something is drastically wrong with that. If someone wants to come here fine with me but don't give me the excuses as to why they do not have to follow the rules.

Indy Student said...


I highly doubt your grandparents had to go through the hurdle that is legal immigration currently. If it was Ellis Island, or around that time, you weren't even asked for ID to enter the country (assuming your family made it, survived the journey, or wasn't turned away).

So if you want the same standard that your grandparents went by, that's immigration with no documentation.

The LEGAL immigration system is broken here. It is not broken because of illegal immigrants (which, BTW, is a code violation, not criminal law). Unskilled laborers have no chance of coming here unless they marry a citizen, and even then, there's quite a few loopholes. The same conservatives that want government to stay out of business probably don't realize that if a company wants to hire someone overseas, they'll have to jump through hoops just to get them here temporarily.

As for current laws not being enforced, the Department of Homeland Security has been arresting those attempting to cross at an 60% increase between 2002-2008, and 2009's records AGAIN were broken.


So immigration laws have been on the upswing of enforcement since 2002, and 2009 saw AGAIN a record breaking number of those caught at the border.

As for the "I'VE GOTTA SHOW ID EVERYWHERE" talking point, you're doing so voluntarily 99% of the time. The only time anyone can ever demand ID from you when you haven't broken any law, ordinance, etc... is if you're driving. And Arizona is a unique state that their Drivers Licenses can only be issued to citizens (how that works for those on visas, study abroad programs, green cards, etc..., I don't know). In most states, drivers licenses do NOT prove citizenship or immigration status. A birth certificate would, but no one keeps that on them.

My contention with the law is that LEOs are not trained to enforce them, and probably do not have the capabilities of doing so. Any issues about immigration should be made by federal authorities, since the federal government defines what is and is not a citizen.

Paul K. Ogden said...

Guest, yes or no, will you support fixing the immigration laws we have? I'm sure the answer is "no." You don't care that the system is hopelessly broken because you don't want immigration at all.. You're not just anti-illegal immigratio. You're anti-immigration.

I love it when people haul out the claim that generations ago their ancestors came over legally. The immigration system was far different then than it is today. Unlike then, you now spent years floundering in the system, spending tens of thousands of dollars languishing for years waiting on government to make a decision The people who make this argument would be correct if the system their forefathers experienced was the reality of what people experience today. It isn't. My ancestors came over here in the middle 1700s. They did it legally. Wasn't hard sicne immigrating simply meant getting here.

Bottom line is they don't care. I don't think they'd care if it took 30 years and hundreds of thousands of dollars to become legal. That just means less immigration which is what they want. The problem is it means also more ILLEGAL immigration and more people living in the shadows. That doesn't benefit anyone.

Marycatherine Barton said...

I am in accord with Guest's comment of 5:35, and thank him/her for it. As for Mexico, it is a collapsing country, and ours is not far behind. A North-American Union is what the ruling class is working to impose on us, and thank goodness there are patriots working hard to oppose them.

Already the filthy rich puppet Bill Clinton, who gave us NAFTA, that has devastated the economies of both Mexico and the USA, is traveling the world proclaiming that there should be no borders. When I heard George HW Bush calling for a new world order, during his one-term as president, I immediately thought of the speeches of Adolph Hitler, who called for the same. Cathy O'Brien has written in TRANSFORMATION OF AMERICA, about conversations she heard the Clintons and Bushs having about the plans of the globalists, for just this.

Thanks to Senator Mike Delph for trying to represent the needs of his Hoosier constiuents re illegal immigration. The immigration laws were rewritten by a group in Congress, with their own agenda, that would make it nearly impossible for my four Irish grandparents to immigrate here today. I love immigrants who are honest, respect our Constitutional Bill of Rights, and accept our laws allowing us free speech, the right to assemble, and gun ownership. Thanks.

Citizen Kane said...

The laws that need to be enforced are the laws that require businesses to hire citizens and resident aliens instead of illegal aliens. There was a concerted effort, beginning generally in meatpacking plants in the Midwest, etc. to recruit south of the border shortly after the Reagan amnesty, while of course, at the same time throwing American citizens out of work, lowering wages and working conditions. With NAFTA destroying Mexican agriculture, in the mid-90's the table was set for wholesale migration of illiterate peasant farmers to the Estados Unidos. From there the illegal recruiting spread like wildfire to those industries that could more easily absorb poorly educated, non-English speaking workers.

And as I have said many times before, all one has to do is take a serious look at California and one can easily discern that the wonder of California is due to its legal immigration, while the disaster of California is its illegal immigration.

If you want to believe that making the immigration process simpler will create a better country, have at it, but I guarantee if we move in that direction, you will regret it.

And as for our immigration system being difficult, it is like every other part of our over-regulated government; the law is riddled with special favors that make it difficult to deal with, except for those who directly benefit from the special favors, like the Saudi's with the use of the "Visa Express" program that brought several of the 9/11 hijackers into this country, without the scrutiny of anyone on this side of the border (since eliminated from the law). So, yeah, there is a lot of crap in the law that needs to go, but when people talk about enforcing the law, they are talking about the basic tenets, not the absurdities.

And, with one of the great absurdities being that we (one of the few remaining Western countries) allow anyone to step over the border for any reason and expel an American citizen out of their womb, without the parent being under the jurisdiction or having any allegiance to this country. It is these kind of absurdities that anger the general public.

Indy Student said...

Paul, I wouldn't say just because people use the "when my family immigrated" talking point, they're anti-immigration. They're just simply ignorant of how easy it was to get into the country. Carl Brizzi used that talking point on his radio show a few SAturdays ago.

Guest said...

Ellis Island or not-they still went through the system that was in place at the time and became legal U.S. citizens. They were invited to this country to work. They also learned the language and in the end were granted U.S. citizenship after following procedures. Gee you sure like to turn an argument which brings me to clarify the wimpy men in the country statement: The woman governor of Arizona took a right stand to do something about a huge problem for our country while all the men such as yourself are nit picking that stance and defending what is illegal, mincing and parsing, quibling and ignoring the basic tenent that if you want to live here -get legal, and follow the laws. You are the one making excuses for it. That is what people are angry about. By the way, I thought more of you than to see you write that someone making a point is turned into -as you say- anti any immigration. Touche.

Indy Student said...

Guest,yes. And since you're waxing nostalgia on Ellis Island, do you think that's an appropriate way of immigration today?

It's a talking point that because your ancestors (not you) did something eons ago, that someone else can do that same task now. But then, the borders were basically open. Now, they aren't, and legal immigration is a boondoggle.

So how bout this? We'll help build the fence if you agree to help reform the immigration process.

I just love that these DON'T TREAD ON ME types are so quick to give more police powers.

And yes, you should have to clarify that statement. It was poorly written and thus no one can understand it.

I don't care about the gender of the governor that you put so much emphasis on. The governor of Arizona has chosen to govern Arizona. That does not mean we should adopt the same laws as Arizona, because well, this isn't Arizona. And yes, when passing laws, you have to respect the U.S. and state constitution. If that's something that's over your head, I'd suggest reading them. They're written in fairly simple language.

Yes, you see it as nitpicking, but tough. You like wasting tax dollars? Judge Napolitono has said that this law will bankrupt the state after the numerous lawsuits.

But Guest, you do come off as very anti-immigration, period. You refuse to recognize the bureaucracy that legal immigration has become, and seem to think it's just like the Ellis Island days. News flash: It's not.

Marycatherine Barton said...

On the halls of Congress yesterday, Congressman Tom McClintock quoted President Ted Roosevelt re the requirements and philosophy governing immigration, at that time, and two things he said was essential was that 1) the immigrant speak English, and 2) the immigrant only be loyal to the American people. How far the government of the USA has veered from those values.

You can read Paul Joseph Watson on this, "Congressman Slams Outrage of Calderon Lecture on Immigration" 5/21/10, at Have a great weekend.

Indy Student said...

Mary, I think those are excellent requirements and would have no problem making them it, and then we decide on how many people can come through a year.

foretell said...

Way to destroy your credibility Paul!
The law should not be enforced because it disfavors the people who pay your law firm.
Don’t worry about making a coherent argument. By disagreeing with you, anyone is absolutely proven to be a racist.

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